What is your departments' primary ventilation?

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Joe Heim on October 28, 2008 at 2:06pm

We mostly do horizontal ventilation. This is basically due to limited manpower in the early stages. We will try and go to the roof but that does not always happen. The one thing that needs to be remembered on either one it to make sure it is coordinated with the compnies inside.

Permalink Reply by Jim Mason on October 29, 2008 at 7:46pm

coordination is critical. Sometimes I think it what we forget in the fire service.
I think the fire service did it better when we didn;t have masks on because we had to then

Permalink Reply by Jim Wilk on October 29, 2008 at 9:37pm

We our the 1st due truck to 3 communities that border us. On my shift we split our truck into two teams. The officer and two ff's will go to the roof and two ff will either search or do horizontal ventilation. I don't know if I agree with this but it is up to the officer. I think it should be the opposite, with 2 ff's going to the roof and the officer and 2 ff's going in. The other problem is the interior attack may be under way before we make the roof. In the burbs we seem to forget about the coordination part.

Permalink Reply by Jim Wilk on October 29, 2008 at 9:49pm

I was always taught that if guys are under the roof, guys go on the roof to ventilate. The mask comment is right on. Too many times ff's rush into an environment that they should not be in but they are so encapsulated they don't know until it was to late.

Permalink Reply by Jim Mason on October 30, 2008 at 5:39pm

Wow, You guys have 5 man trucks?
Yeah , I'm a reliever which is a floater. When I'm on the truck I like to be inside so if need be I can coordinate it a bit.
The big problem with coordination is the forcible entry problems. If ther aren;t any F/E prblems, like on a residence, the engine is in fast. If it's commercial the engine may be in too slow. I think the size up determines how to coordinate the venting with the hose work. That's why I think it's good for the offcier to be inside.

Permalink Reply by Jim Mason on October 30, 2008 at 5:42pm

Horizontal is very quick but the seat of the fire needs to be determined. Like Jim W nd I were saying the coordination needs to be there for the room to be vented. Can your engine officers direct the windows to be vented from inside? and do they or maybe the truck officer? Chris Take a look at our discussion with the video "You're first due now what" We 'd like to hear from you on this one as far as venting goes

Permalink Reply by Jim Mason on October 30, 2008 at 5:49pm

Yeah It's the old saying "When the cotton hits the street , the stick goes to the roof" but that was on large dept's like Chgo where there are FF's everywhere. I'm concerned about getting effective venting , in a coordinated way so guys can advance the hose and the truck can make the rescues.
I think it is much harder to do this w/ less FF's for one specific reason - we have to be right on with our size up and coordination (of engine and truck)

Permalink Reply by Jim Wilk on October 30, 2008 at 6:11pm

Our minimum is 2, 4 man engines and 1, 3 man truck. along with 2 ambo with ff/medics. This is our usual manning during the summer months. If this is the case the ambo with chase the truck and supplement manning. If we have 4 on the truck, they may or may not chase. It has worked out well for us.
Where are you a reliever? I know a couple of people on the city. I rode a couple of times years ago at E-47 when wojtecki was captain there. Now my buddy is on squad 2.

Permalink Reply by Jim Wilk on October 30, 2008 at 6:16pm

How does Chicago split up there truck companies?

Permalink Reply by Erich Roden on November 2, 2008 at 8:49pm

Peaked roof ventilation is a SECONDARY operation at most private dwellings. However, if you are operating at a balloon-frame 2 1/2 story private dwelling (or Queen Anne [Victorian]), it can be considered a primary operation. This is only a primary consideration if there is heavy fire and or smoke in the attic space. These attic spaces hold a tremendous amount of fire and has kept many an Engine at bay at the second floor landing until the roof was opened. Furthermore, these attic spaces are often fully occupied. Unless you have an attic space that can be occupied, you are wasting your time and manpower to ventilate it; particularly in newer homes where the only possible attic inhabitants are the squirrels that chew their way in. Also, the Engine is not going to advance into attic spaces in newer private dwellings. Instead, have people vent from the outside and inside to benefit the Engine and occupants' inhabitable areas, respectively.

Permalink Reply by Scott Kleinschmidt on November 2, 2008 at 9:56pm

I would have to agree with "single room and contents" move it Horizontally. I would have to disagree with if I am understanding you right and maybe I am missing your point "Unless you have an attic space that can be occupied, you are wasting your time and manpower to ventilate it; particularly in newer homes" If I have more than a "single room and contents.. and heat and more importantly smoke conditions warrent it "open the roof" punch the ceiling and get the smoke and BTU's moving in the direction they want to go UP and OUT. This if your crews train on it can be a "fast" operation. We teach our crews time and manpower? How long to get the vent? 6/12 or less no involment or limited involment in attic is a fast operation. Up and down in less than 3 min. 6/12 and up? If they have a good spot on the truck, up and down "bucket cut" less than 6 min from the brake being set. If the truck has a bad spot " over head obstructions" than take into consideration how long to throw ground and roof ladders to get the vent. This will take more time on the steeper roof. I have seen the benifits of opening up the roof on PD's both inside and out. This would always be my first thought on arrival if the conditions warrent.

Permalink Reply by Jim Mason on November 3, 2008 at 4:15pm

I'm a reliever in the first district. I'm from the fifth district. The stops were E116, Sq2 and TL 39. 6th district relief for 2 yeras and 1st district relief for the last 2 years. Do all your truck officers work on the roof?

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