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Hey guys. I have a question. Had a vehicle accident today. The car was rear ended. No damage to the front end. The drivers door was pinned shut. Air bags were not deployed.Drivers window up and in tack. Long story short. Trying to pop the hood to access the battery, to cut power from the air bags. While we were extricating. Could not access the hood release or the cable. Had to go straight for the latch. My question is. What is the best way to do this and what tools to use. Jaws were being used elswhere and had a prob with them. Couldn,t use a sawsall, gas everywhere. We eventually got it with two halligans, a spud bar and brute strength.

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Adam Miceli said:
It's sad, but I've seen many firefighters look like the proverbial monkey/football mating game when attempting to open a hood. We too have the Felkin's Hood tools and they're certainly worth the little money they cost (still available?) I'd be more inclined to use the hydraulic tools for cutting than a k-12 if they're available. The saw is loud, presents a significant ignition source and is far more hazardous to any responders not in full turnout gear.

Adam!
The stabilization crew should be on air with a hose line anyway. Everyone working on cutting the car should be in everything but their BA.
Larry
Well, I know that might be how it's "supposed to be", but I'm certain that that level of use far exceeds how most of us actually turnout for an MVA. I'm not saying you're wrong, as we seem to blow off far more precautionary things at MVA's than other incident types. In the case of the leaking fuel, I'd certainly think most crews would up the level, but in that case I'd still prefer not to have been the ignition source. Nothing good can come of it, and as this thread has proven, a jury of peers might say there were safer methods than the K-saw in this situation.

Larry Lasich said:
Adam Miceli said:
It's sad, but I've seen many firefighters look like the proverbial monkey/football mating game when attempting to open a hood. We too have the Felkin's Hood tools and they're certainly worth the little money they cost (still available?) I'd be more inclined to use the hydraulic tools for cutting than a k-12 if they're available. The saw is loud, presents a significant ignition source and is far more hazardous to any responders not in full turnout gear.

Adam!
The stabilization crew should be on air with a hose line anyway. Everyone working on cutting the car should be in everything but their BA.
Larry
Somewhat related, we use the Felkins Hood Release Tool with good success, but that would not have helped in this case since you could not find the cable. The reason for my post is I am trying to purchase more of the tools, but can't find them. The phone number has changed and I can't find them online. Anyone have a lead on where we can find them?

In this case we would use either a port-a-power to force the hood or use a recip saw. We carry spray bottles full of soapy water and applied in copius amounts it would keep the risk of fire to almost zero. We use recip saws alot and never even see them spark. I think there is no perfect answer for this case- good luck!
Hey Brian: I kinda of thought of using the water to keep sparks down(after thought). Ill have to discuss this option with the others. THANKS!!!

Brian Davis said:
Somewhat related, we use the Felkins Hood Release Tool with good success, but that would not have helped in this case since you could not find the cable. The reason for my post is I am trying to purchase more of the tools, but can't find them. The phone number has changed and I can't find them online. Anyone have a lead on where we can find them?

In this case we would use either a port-a-power to force the hood or use a recip saw. We carry spray bottles full of soapy water and applied in copius amounts it would keep the risk of fire to almost zero. We use recip saws alot and never even see them spark. I think there is no perfect answer for this case- good luck!
Adam Miceli said:
Well, I know that might be how it's "supposed to be", but I'm certain that that level of use far exceeds how most of us actually turnout for an MVA. I'm not saying you're wrong, as we seem to blow off far more precautionary things at MVA's than other incident types. In the case of the leaking fuel, I'd certainly think most crews would up the level, but in that case I'd still prefer not to have been the ignition source. Nothing good can come of it, and as this thread has proven, a jury of peers might say there were safer methods than the K-saw in this situation.

Larry Lasich said:
Adam Miceli said:
It's sad, but I've seen many firefighters look like the proverbial monkey/football mating game when attempting to open a hood. We too have the Felkin's Hood tools and they're certainly worth the little money they cost (still available?) I'd be more inclined to use the hydraulic tools for cutting than a k-12 if they're available. The saw is loud, presents a significant ignition source and is far more hazardous to any responders not in full turnout gear.

Adam!
The stabilization crew should be on air with a hose line anyway. Everyone working on cutting the car should be in everything but their BA.
Larry

Speaking as a major safety pain, I have everyone completely wrapped up during extracation. There are just too meny close call reports and videos of us at car fires and wrecks when we are trying to get ourselves hurt. I also wouldn't have a problem telling the stabilization crew to skip the battery if I was short of manpower and it was taking too long or they couldn't get to it without creating a bigger problem. I'd just make sure that there was a crew standing by on the hose and tell everyone to be super carefull around the airbag and electrical systems. After all, what are you going to do if you can't find the battery? Stop the proccess?
Tom, This is a technique I have taught and have used several time with sucess poping hoods when the interior latch is inaccessable. With a haligan or ram bar take out the front grill of the vehicle. The hood latch cable should be either visiable in front of the radiator on on top of the radiator housing. Use the fork end of the haligan or the fork of an "A" tool and twist the cable in the fork. The cable will either pop the hood as you twist or give the tool a quick movement laterly and the hood should pop. Do not pull outward as this causes the cable to break away from the latch. Try it the next time you conduct extrication training.
What a great discussion...Its simple questions like this that every firefighter can relate to. No matter the size of their dept. at one time or another they will be called upon to "pop" a hood. The "cutters" and "bolt cutters" never thought about that before myself. Learned something today! Cannot rely on finding the cable, I remember a car fire that our crew worked. Our dumb a$$es looked like four monkeys with one football. Live and Learn.

FTM,
Bob
We use a method like what Brent was discusing, however we just use the end of the halligan to wrap the cable and roll in a clockwise motion. It works great.. I have never heard of the "hood tool" or "felkins tool" im going have to check those out so thanks Brent and Jeff for that tidbit. Take care guys and stay safe
Thanks for the replies guys.
Scott: I have heard of using the halligan that way. Have not tried it yet though. Will try to remember it for the next time.

Just a little side note. When all else fails. A long spud bar gave us some good upward leverage. With 2-guys, 2-halligans and the spud bar. We finally got it. A little but wooping. But we got it LOL
Did that rock the car at all?

Tom Burger said:
Thanks for the replies guys.
Scott: I have heard of using the halligan that way. Have not tried it yet though. Will try to remember it for the next time.

Just a little side note. When all else fails. A long spud bar gave us some good upward leverage. With 2-guys, 2-halligans and the spud bar. We finally got it. A little but wooping. But we got it LOL
Not to bad. Already had guy's stabelizing the car with cribbing. I don't think we did any more than the EMS & Jaws guys


Todd McKee said:
Did that rock the car at all?

Tom Burger said:
Thanks for the replies guys.
Scott: I have heard of using the halligan that way. Have not tried it yet though. Will try to remember it for the next time.

Just a little side note. When all else fails. A long spud bar gave us some good upward leverage. With 2-guys, 2-halligans and the spud bar. We finally got it. A little but wooping. But we got it LOL
I understand about the fuel hazard, but if we stretch a charged line and spray the ground really good perhaps then we can use the K-12. If this is still to much of a hazard or we do not carry a saw, prying open the corners of the hood will grant us access to the usual spots where the battery is,unless it is a new hybrid.

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