Need information on part time FF's replacing career FF's

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Permalink Reply by Chris Fleming on September 17, 2009 at 8:36am

Bryan,
I'm not familiar with your situation, but it sounds difficult. I think it is important to define what you and your members provide to the public. This not only means what you do on the street, but levels of knowledge, training, and experience. This is easy to do if you have well defined training rquirements and well maintained training records. This way you can point out the differences between your members and potential part time employees. Check your collective bargaining agreement and with a labor lawyer as this may not be legal. Good luck, and keep us posted.

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Permalink Reply by Jay VandeBerg on September 23, 2009 at 9:03pm

Is your department looking to supplement the career union personnel with part timers? Or is your department changing existing career positions to part time through attrition or layoffs? I would suggest talking to your steward or union leadership, as they should be addressing the issue if it affects your career positions. There are laws in certain states pertaining to "substitutions" or replacing full time sworn personnel with part time, contract or volunteer. The State of Illinois has a "substitutes" bill. This may have also been outlined in your collective bargaining agreement. (if you have one)

Otherwise, I will put my feelers out for you and try and get any information I can.

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Permalink Reply by Bryan Downie on September 24, 2009 at 8:55am

Thanks for the reply. We're not sure what the mayor has in mind. A a recent council meeting he was unable to answer questions from councilmembers whether the part timers would be called in as needed to reduce over time or scheduled as a part of the crew. I'll have our union e board check the state laws on substitutions, thats a good point.
The union is very much involved and I'm just trying to gain whatever info I can to help as this is new to all of us. We can't find any other city (so far) in Ohio. Thanks again for the help.

Bryan
so we 'Jay VandeBerg said:

Is your department looking to supplement the career union personnel with part timers? Or is your department changing existing career positions to part time through attrition or layoffs? I would suggest talking to your steward or union leadership, as they should be addressing the issue if it affects your career positions. There are laws in certain states pertaining to "substitutions" or replacing full time sworn personnel with part time, contract or volunteer. The State of Illinois has a "substitutes" bill. This may have also been outlined in your collective bargaining agreement. (if you have one)

Otherwise, I will put my feelers out for you and try and get any information I can.

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Permalink Reply by Bryan Downie on September 24, 2009 at 9:03am

Thanks for the reply Chris. We are doing many of the things you listed.Our position, as is the chiefs, is they must undergo the same training for any new hire, regardless of experience. Currently, even if you have your firefighting 1 and 2 certification and paramedic, certification, you must undergo a 8 week orientation program to our department. This is done on a 40 hr. work week schedule where probies spend time at each station, learn the streets, buildings, equipment, SOP's and are tested on our EMS protocols as well as become current in ACLS, ITLS, and PALS. All this before they even hit the streets on a shift. The city seems to think you interview today and they start on the trucks tomorrow.
Three years ago we hired two guys with over 6 years each from Cleveland Fire and they were subject to the same probationary orientation as everyone else.

Thaks,
Bryan

Chris Fleming said:

Bryan,
I'm not familiar with your situation, but it sounds difficult. I think it is important to define what you and your members provide to the public. This not only means what you do on the street, but levels of knowledge, training, and experience. This is easy to do if you have well defined training rquirements and well maintained training records. This way you can point out the differences between your members and potential part time employees. Check your collective bargaining agreement and with a labor lawyer as this may not be legal. Good luck, and keep us posted.

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