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Building a Team
What do you feel is the most significant roadblock to building a team, any team. From an engine company, station crew or battalion to a special operations team such as hazardous materials or technical rescue
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Ben Fleagle on -
Scott:
Great discussion! You guys are all hitting the mark! I was thrilled to see new verbage breaking out once again on FE!
Often I think we are confident in our abilities and we feel we understand the battlefield enough to make informed, educated decisions and this clashes with the comfort level of others we work with or lead. I personally am very comfortable in the opposing lane, but I only stay there as long as necessary and I am always, cautious. Others I work with never, ever cross the yellow.
But anyway, a few months ago, I was the senior officer on a team making entry, attempting to hit the seat of a stubborn fire. This job had been a long one and we were all frozen cold and starting to not make the best decisions. The other officer with me sometimes doesn't communicate well and not suprisingly, he and the IC became confused with each other over our objective. Our orders were actually very clear. The fire had burned out of control an excessive amount of time, collapse had occured in another part of the structure and we were not to go beyond a particular load bearing wall. Before I knew it, the other officer and a probie had made the wall access and gone farther, (because you know how it is, you realize the fire is farther in than you thought or you see something that makes you think you can get it!) This other officer is twice my size and although very respectful and a good friend, is inclined to argue a point right in the middle of a storm. So with the probie in mind, I caught up, figured out what he was trying to do, sent him back to the door (instead of arguing), and helped the probie get the job done quickly and then both of us beat feet as fast as we could back to our safety line! Toooo late, there's the Chief....man, he chewed my keester up down and backwards, he was hot!! You see he trusts me, and I could tell he felt I let him down. I didn't even bother to explain, I just let him take it out on me. I felt I had made the best decision I could, what kind of officer would I be if I let the probie go into a questionable situation with an officer who didn't have the full picture? What kind of officer would I be if I blamed it on the two of them and their failed communication or on the fact that the other guy is always getting information all tangled up? I felt it was better to put myself there instead and cut it short, I just wasn't fast enough.
I was forgiven, but those moments come often it seems. They tend to be created by a lack of communication or mis-communication. Sometimes, I think we feel confident in ourselves and that scares other people a bit. I try to make my decisions based on what is best for the people I lead, not the other way around. I also believe in getting the job done the first time, so we can minimize the cluster****s like the one I found myself in that night. Sometimes it can really get me into trouble.
As for leadership. I began my first night on shift as an officer by staring at the ceiling above my bunk thinking, "Oh *****! I'm responsible for these guys!" I've never really stopped. I no longer feel that terror, havent' for many long years. But I'm always, always thinking about them, or what I need to do to improve myself or the team..for them. Like the Sgt. Major said, its 24/7, ...if it isn't, who are you doing it for?
By the way, tell your Dad I said "Semper Fi, Sgt. Major, ...Semper Fi!!"
Scott Richardson said:Brothers Drew, John, and Todd,
first let me say...It is nice to see you guys, again. I had a few busy months where I was away; something was missing! I hope everyone has had a safe, great summer! I went to the mountains of Colorado last night and it felt like late fall. Time goes by so fast.
You guys make some great points, specifically, (Drew), not being perfect, making mistakes; John, "Anyone that leads and expects to be perfect has defeated themselves before they have begun". What a great thought! and Todd, perhaps the most profound: "To answer your question what is the biggest roadblock to building a team? I would say at times we stand in our way of our own success"!
I struggle with trying to always have the "perfect" solution. Just last shift I made a decision that, perhaps was not the safest decision. Without boring you with all the details, here is a summary. I am a LT on a Tower Ladder Company that has ALS capabilities. We received a call for seizures on a highway, just south of an exit ramp with sketchy details. This HWY intersects another a half mile south of the location given. I opted to SLOWLY oppose traffic up an exit ramp with visibility for (approx) 1000 feet. I had the engineer come to a complete stop at the top until we were sure everyone was stopped, then we made a right turn and headed to the call. Our dispatchers are usually AWESOME. That said, this was one of those times where the stuff was hitting the fan all over the district. I have had these "gut feelings" as a paramedic before, you know, the one where you are responding and things don't add up and you get that pit in your stomach! Mind you I had nothing concrete to base it on except poor access information and communication (on this call), and 11 years as a paramedic...Long story cut off, the "call" I made was the right one and we reached the guy in 15 seconds once we knew where he was. He was in seizures for fifteen minutes prior to our arrival, starting to posture, and one of my rock-star FFs got a quick IV as I was getting history from the wife (over the phone). When the medic (FD ambulance) arrived we gave Valium immediately and transported the 2 miles to the hospital, unable to intubate due to him biting his tongue (almost in half) and being clenched down. On arrival in the ED, it tool a respiratory doc and a camera (with sedation) ten minutes to successfully intubate. The call had a good outcome. What we didn't know (when I made my response decisions) is that he had a device placed inside him that fired every 30 seconds to keep him from seizures.
Was my decision to oppose traffic appropriate, perhaps. Did it make my crew uncomfortable, absolutely. To his credit, one member came to talk to me that evening and expressed his displeasure with the "call" I made to oppose traffic. Right or wrong, I must admit, I appreciate that member talking to me about it. My decision was not based on an algorithm, policy, or procedure. It was based on a "gut feeling" that this call was going down hill.
You gentlemen have followed this discussion long enough to know how meticulous I am regarding safety. Regardless of how "good" I think I am at safety, if one of my members feels strongly enough to speak up to me about an issue, I have to do some soul searching and make sure my stuff is on the right track.
I would make the same decision again, especially having the benefit of knowing the outcome. Even though we were two minutes from the ED, this man, in my opinion would most certainly gone into cardiac arrest had we not intervened as quickly as we did. The Medic and next Engine Company were about 4 minutes behind us. The patient crashed in a matter of 10 total minutes of on-scene and transport time.
Has this type of thing ever happened to you before, either as the formal leader or member of a team?
Thanks Brothas and Sistas! Be SAFE!!!
Scott
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Permalink Reply by Drew Smith on -
This is a great discussion.
Scott, Todd, Ben, and John-
Your comments are like a breath of fresh air. While I'm not at all depressed or discouraged, it's nice to hear from the 20% (20% of the organization does 80% of the work). We just started a new firefighter academy class where in my "spare time" I serve and the program manager. In this class we have 15 new firefighters from about a dozen departments. This too reenergizes me. It makes me want to lead even better because these candidates have not been tainted, have yet to develope habits and can truly be led by our 25+ instructors from 12+ departments. Most of our instructors are 20+ years members of the fire service and live the fire service. But we have some young blood that lives it as well.
As I read the previous posts and contemplated, I remembered the following personal sort of mission/vision/values I wrote up 12 years ago and which still sits on my desk. A few times a year one of our membes will come into my office and I'll catch them reading it. I can see they think "does he really mean it?" I hope they answer YES!
What’s Important to Me
Enjoying work
Completing assigned work
Knowing my rig is 100% ready, without question
Training and Public Education
Being Proud of the rigs, building, us
To reach this point, I keep the rigs, building, us as clean and neat as possible
You only get once change to make a first impressions
Treating members, others, customers like I want to be treated
Not talking down to a customer
Doing a little extra for the customer
Such as providing directions, assisting with securing the home on an EMS call, and salvage work at fires, no matter how small or large
I don’t always get to do these things 100% of the time, and sometimes I’m laxed, but I still keep on trying. -Drew Smith
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Permalink Reply by Scott Richardson on -
Hey Drew,
Thanks for the kind words! I enjoyed reading your personal mission/vision/values statements. I believe it is important to have these. albeit everyone's would and should be a little bit different. They should ultimately drive us in the same direction...customer service whether it is internal, external, or self! You hit on that when yoou touched on apparatus preparedness. being 110%, all the time is impossible but it becomes much easier to get close if your environment (station, apparatus, crew) are trained and prepared mentally and physically.
Take care...be safe!!!
Scott
Drew Smith said:This is a great discussion.
Scott, Todd, Ben, and John-
Your comments are like a breath of fresh air. While I'm not at all depressed or discouraged, it's nice to hear from the 20% (20% of the organization does 80% of the work). We just started a new firefighter academy class where in my "spare time" I serve and the program manager. In this class we have 15 new firefighters from about a dozen departments. This too reenergizes me. It makes me want to lead even better because these candidates have not been tainted, have yet to develope habits and can truly be led by our 25+ instructors from 12+ departments. Most of our instructors are 20+ years members of the fire service and live the fire service. But we have some young blood that lives it as well.
As I read the previous posts and contemplated, I remembered the following personal sort of mission/vision/values I wrote up 12 years ago and which still sits on my desk. A few times a year one of our membes will come into my office and I'll catch them reading it. I can see they think "does he really mean it?" I hope they answer YES!
What’s Important to Me
Enjoying work
Completing assigned work
Knowing my rig is 100% ready, without question
Training and Public Education
Being Proud of the rigs, building, us
To reach this point, I keep the rigs, building, us as clean and neat as possible
You only get once change to make a first impressions
Treating members, others, customers like I want to be treated
Not talking down to a customer
Doing a little extra for the customer
Such as providing directions, assisting with securing the home on an EMS call, and salvage work at fires, no matter how small or large
I don’t always get to do these things 100% of the time, and sometimes I’m laxed, but I still keep on trying. -Drew Smith
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Permalink Reply by John Power on -
I Just want to take a moment and say....Damn it is good to hear from you guys, and Todd...Welcome my Brother from east of me. I knew you would fit in well here! Looking forward to some more GREAT discussions!!!!!
John
Scott Richardson said:Hey Drew,
Thanks for the kind words! I enjoyed reading your personal mission/vision/values statements. I believe it is important to have these. albeit everyone's would and should be a little bit different. They should ultimately drive us in the same direction...customer service whether it is internal, external, or self! You hit on that when yoou touched on apparatus preparedness. being 110%, all the time is impossible but it becomes much easier to get close if your environment (station, apparatus, crew) are trained and prepared mentally and physically.
Take care...be safe!!!
Scott
Drew Smith said:This is a great discussion.
Scott, Todd, Ben, and John-
Your comments are like a breath of fresh air. While I'm not at all depressed or discouraged, it's nice to hear from the 20% (20% of the organization does 80% of the work). We just started a new firefighter academy class where in my "spare time" I serve and the program manager. In this class we have 15 new firefighters from about a dozen departments. This too reenergizes me. It makes me want to lead even better because these candidates have not been tainted, have yet to develope habits and can truly be led by our 25+ instructors from 12+ departments. Most of our instructors are 20+ years members of the fire service and live the fire service. But we have some young blood that lives it as well.
As I read the previous posts and contemplated, I remembered the following personal sort of mission/vision/values I wrote up 12 years ago and which still sits on my desk. A few times a year one of our membes will come into my office and I'll catch them reading it. I can see they think "does he really mean it?" I hope they answer YES!
What’s Important to Me
Enjoying work
Completing assigned work
Knowing my rig is 100% ready, without question
Training and Public Education
Being Proud of the rigs, building, us
To reach this point, I keep the rigs, building, us as clean and neat as possible
You only get once change to make a first impressions
Treating members, others, customers like I want to be treated
Not talking down to a customer
Doing a little extra for the customer
Such as providing directions, assisting with securing the home on an EMS call, and salvage work at fires, no matter how small or large
I don’t always get to do these things 100% of the time, and sometimes I’m laxed, but I still keep on trying. -Drew Smith
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Permalink Reply by Eric Shields on -
I've found one of the biggest things blocking teambuilding is a 'leader' that discredits those above him. I can't believe officers don't understand that when they do this, they teach their subordinates to argue, disagree and voice opinions. Why should a team trust the leader that isn't dedicated to the team he also plays for? Among the most memorable scenes from Saving Private Ryan is the explanation by Tom Hanks, when asked what he thought of their mission. He explains that complaining to them is not an option. The mission of an officer is to carry out the mission, not identify everything that's wrong with it. If you're an officer struggling to build a team, look in the mirror.
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Permalink Reply by Scott Richardson on
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Hi Eric:
You pose a great point. I agree with your alalysis of the destruction such behavior causes. I am sure, at one time or another we have all been guilty of this. The leadership comes when we realize we have done this, or that it is happening within our team. That's when it is time to take a step back and figure out why it is happening. I believe that (if we can find the root cause) we can reverse this attitude over time.
I have a crew most officers would dream of having. To a person they are the most motivated, knowledgeable, dedicated firefighters I have ever worked with. That said, they are hard chargers that are always learning. This type of crew is an entirely different challenge. That is, they are so inquisitive that they constantly challenge with the question, why. This NEVER occurs on incidents or during operations but presents a great challenge and learning experience for the entire crew. The crew understands that, while we may not understand or agree with the decisions made by the chain of command but we have a responsibility to uphold those decisions.
Food for thought.
Eric Shields said:I've found one of the biggest things blocking teambuilding is a 'leader' that discredits those above him. I can't believe officers don't understand that when they do this, they teach their subordinates to argue, disagree and voice opinions. Why should a team trust the leader that isn't dedicated to the team he also plays for? Among the most memorable scenes from Saving Private Ryan is the explanation by Tom Hanks, when asked what he thought of their mission. He explains that complaining to them is not an option. The mission of an officer is to carry out the mission, not identify everything that's wrong with it. If you're an officer struggling to build a team, look in the mirror.
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Permalink Reply by Ben Fleagle on
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"Private Ryan" is one of the best examples of Leadership as it truly is from the trenches. Excellent point, brother!
Eric Shields said:I've found one of the biggest things blocking teambuilding is a 'leader' that discredits those above him. I can't believe officers don't understand that when they do this, they teach their subordinates to argue, disagree and voice opinions. Why should a team trust the leader that isn't dedicated to the team he also plays for? Among the most memorable scenes from Saving Private Ryan is the explanation by Tom Hanks, when asked what he thought of their mission. He explains that complaining to them is not an option. The mission of an officer is to carry out the mission, not identify everything that's wrong with it. If you're an officer struggling to build a team, look in the mirror.
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Permalink Reply by Ben Fleagle on
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Good food. One of the best examples of good leadership I have seen lately is by someone I am proud to call my leader. I haven't often had the opportunity to point out fine leadership traits in the men I have worked for, but this new guy, he's doing great! Being a lateral hire, and for the job I applied for, I didn't have high hopes. But I decided after meeting him that my attitude needed adjusting and that if he was to succeed in taking over at such a high level, he needed the company officers behind him. So I threw in.
One of the many challenges that came flying at us was from the old "shift wars" arena. To his credit, the new battalion made it quite clear to all, and especially his captains that he would not participate, fire back or attack the other shifts. His policy was to perform our duties to the best of our ability and not pass on the crap that was passed to us. He simply refused to play that game. You all know how it goes. Even when you don't want to play along, the shift wars are ever present. We obeyed, and our example, I hope has helped with the crews. Now, six months later, the new BC is doing well, shift wars continue, and our shift really isn't a part of it. His stance has paid off so far. My new boss, he's alright.
Scott Richardson said:Hi Eric:
You pose a great point. I agree with your alalysis of the destruction such behavior causes. I am sure, at one time or another we have all been guilty of this. The leadership comes when we realize we have done this, or that it is happening within our team. That's when it is time to take a step back and figure out why it is happening. I believe that (if we can find the root cause) we can reverse this attitude over time.
I have a crew most officers would dream of having. To a person they are the most motivated, knowledgeable, dedicated firefighters I have ever worked with. That said, they are hard chargers that are always learning. This type of crew is an entirely different challenge. That is, they are so inquisitive that they constantly challenge with the question, why. This NEVER occurs on incidents or during operations but presents a great challenge and learning experience for the entire crew. The crew understands that, while we may not understand or agree with the decisions made by the chain of command but we have a responsibility to uphold those decisions.
Food for thought.
Eric Shields said:I've found one of the biggest things blocking teambuilding is a 'leader' that discredits those above him. I can't believe officers don't understand that when they do this, they teach their subordinates to argue, disagree and voice opinions. Why should a team trust the leader that isn't dedicated to the team he also plays for? Among the most memorable scenes from Saving Private Ryan is the explanation by Tom Hanks, when asked what he thought of their mission. He explains that complaining to them is not an option. The mission of an officer is to carry out the mission, not identify everything that's wrong with it. If you're an officer struggling to build a team, look in the mirror.
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Permalink Reply by Richard B. Gasaway, PhD on -
I don't think there are roadblocks to building a successful team. There may be speed bumps that slow you down, but with the right focus and enthusiasm to succeed, there's not stopping any team. One of the things I think is commonly overlooked is the need for team members to still be able to keep their individual identity. Yes, be a part of the team. Wear the team jersey (or uniform), perform your role for the benefit of the team goals, but maintain your identity. That individual perspective and diversity is part of what makes a team strong. Rich Gasaway www.RichGasaway.com
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Permalink Reply by John Power on
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Hello Doctor and Welcome!
Sorry, I don't know how you prefer to be addressed! You speak of speed bumps, we speak of roadblocks, sorry but that is just semantics. Attitudes, leadership, and many other issues within a team can stop it in it's proverbial tracks!! You may call it what you wish however the end result remains the same.
Individuality/diversity is extremely important, and I agree with you 100 percent! As long as it is at the station!!! Anyone is welcome to say anything, make any suggestions, etc, while we are there. We can all learn from each other, and we all bring something different to the table. That is part of what makes a Great team great! If we were all the same, we would not be very strong!
But when the ship hits the sand....there is NO place for individuality! We are one, or we are not a team! When we are not a team, there can be anything from additional damage to a person's property, to loss of life. Neither is acceptable, if it was because We failed as a team. Individuality on scene promotes freelancing. Freelancing promotes disaster!
I would like to hear more details of your thoughts, as your post was very brief. We may well be on the same or similar page here, or we may not. Please feel free to express yourself in more detail.
Be Safe!!
John
Richard B. Gasaway, PhD said:I don't think there are roadblocks to building a successful team. There may be speed bumps that slow you down, but with the right focus and enthusiasm to succeed, there's not stopping any team. One of the things I think is commonly overlooked is the need for team members to still be able to keep their individual identity. Yes, be a part of the team. Wear the team jersey (or uniform), perform your role for the benefit of the team goals, but maintain your identity. That individual perspective and diversity is part of what makes a team strong. Rich Gasaway www.RichGasaway.com
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Permalink Reply by Ben Fleagle on
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John,
Well said. I was formatting a response to the good Doctor in my head as you posted yours and you beat me to it. But Doctor Gasaway, you have helped me to put my finger on a key point. I feel very strongly that individuality is critical to a successful team, but it is up to the leader of the team to harness that individuality and use it to the teams advantage, and the team members to set aside their individuality when the moment of performance has arrived.
In my opinion, diversity is an overused word these days. I frequently encounter a misconception about this culture of ours; that we somehow brain wash everyone or try to make everyone into a military robot. Any fire officer that is worth his salt as a leader will tell you that the individual personalities of his company are vital to the performance of that company. Of course we are diverse, we are individual people. But what makes us good at our jobs and what sets us apart is that we lay that individuality aside, willingly on a regular basis. Those who hold their "diversity and individuality" so tightly, as if afraid they might lose it, will never actually be able to apply those traits to the team, because they have been reserved for the altar of "SELF".
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Permalink Reply by Scott Richardson on
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Dr. Gasaway,
I would like to welcome you to Building a Team. I appreciate your willingness to sit down with the group and discuss team building. I understand your analogy regarding speed bumps and road blocks. I think we would all agree that individual perspective is essential to the development and cohesiveness of a team. That being said, I believe there are speed bumps and there are road blocks.
Case in point; a (single vehicle) roll-over accident in an Interstate with a single person trapped. The fire department has been handling this accident for decades without the use of advanced vehicle stabilization kits, such as struts. and advanced hydraulic extrication equipment capable of disentangling current heavy steel used to "fortify newer cars.
An example of a Operational challenge (speed bump) using this scenario is: Inability of firefighters to recognize appropriate resources needed to respond to specific incidents outside the "traditional firefighter" role. This is a speed bump because, provided the appropriate educational forum, my extrication instructors can demonstrate the "who, what, when, where, why, and how" of these tools; their integration with standard firefighting practices, and the necessity of that integration.
An example of a roadblock is a member of the command staff being unwilling to change operational response plans to ensure the appropriate technical rescue resources are responding to these incidents so a Plan-B is accounted for before it is needed. This is a road block because the command staff exerts a tremendous amount of input into the operational response guidelines. If they are unwilling to listen objectively to the subject matter experts within their own organization, the need outcome will not happen.
Again, I appreciate and look forward to your discussion.
Scott Richardson
Richard B. Gasaway, PhD said:I don't think there are roadblocks to building a successful team. There may be speed bumps that slow you down, but with the right focus and enthusiasm to succeed, there's not stopping any team. One of the things I think is commonly overlooked is the need for team members to still be able to keep their individual identity. Yes, be a part of the team. Wear the team jersey (or uniform), perform your role for the benefit of the team goals, but maintain your identity. That individual perspective and diversity is part of what makes a team strong. Rich Gasaway www.RichGasaway.com
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